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Old Streetfighter Motorcycle Forum Post 03-02-2018, 12:35 AM   #1
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Default Front end design programe WIP

I contacted the author of a tube miter program I posted because he had some other projects on his page that used technology I could sorta understand and might be useful for a project I've wanted to do for some time. Namely, a web-app version of the program I used to design the front end of the SECApocalypse, with some new features added.

So, it turns out the guy is intrigued, willing to offer advice, and literally has a PHD in suspension design in addition to a personal curiosity regarding mechanical linkages and (bi) cycle construction.

To see if I'd actually be able to make any headway, I spent a few hours reading the code for some of his linkage examples and banging up my own based on them. So far I have a page that draws the two motorcycle wheels based on user input dimensions in such a way that they fill the available horizontal space. The input dimensions are scale-less because I figure the behaviors I'll be looking at are scale invariant; that is, as long as all the dimensions entered are in the same units, it doesn't matter what units you use (and because of the way I'm drawing it, the drawing will be the same size).

Probably the first thing I'll be working on is basic rake / trail stuff for wheel & fork swaps / chopper shit. If I can handle figuring out some of that math, I'll feel better taking on fancier stuff.

Any useful / interesting features people could suggest including?

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Old Streetfighter Motorcycle Forum Post 03-02-2018, 11:27 PM   #2
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Default Re: Front end design programe WIP

WAY the fuck over my head, but I'll be watching.
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Old Streetfighter Motorcycle Forum Post 03-03-2018, 12:40 AM   #3
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Default Re: Front end design programe WIP

Here's my work so far. Not much to it, just enough to see what / how hard it is to do stuff (hard, I'll certainly need a better / more sophisticated approach to the math and data) but it does manage to figure out trail based on basic measurements. Has default numbers, but you should be able to change em and re-draw.

Right now all I've got is a basic illustrated trail calculator, and that seemed a lot of work (maybe 4-8 hours). I did manage to make it work for raked trees though (easier than expected), whick lets you try some rather weird setups (like negative tree rakes and fairly large offsets, that result in vertical fork legs but normal rake / trail figures). Obviously its not doing any kinematics; that setup would be AWFUL of kinematics. Or maybe not - I've seen one design that actually does just that, with the intent of decreasing trail while on the front brake to make steering while braking easier; there's some sense to that, and I did notice that when I had "normal" trail on the SECApocalyps, steering while braking was quite hard, perhaps due to the lack of trail decrease (rake decrease due to brake dive with a normal fork).

https://sebwiers.github.io/motorcycle-front-end
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Old Streetfighter Motorcycle Forum Post 03-04-2018, 09:04 PM   #4
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Default Re: Front end design programe WIP

Gah. I have something pretty cool in the works, am SO close to getting it done, but the math is squishing my brain.
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Old Streetfighter Motorcycle Forum Post 05-09-2018, 06:38 PM   #5
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Default Re: Front end design programe WIP

Seb, why not just buy Tony's software and get on to building bikes. His front suspension specific package include a variety of "alternative" suspension deign parameters.

https://www.tonyfoale.com/

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Old Streetfighter Motorcycle Forum Post 05-10-2018, 12:33 AM   #6
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Default Re: Front end design programe WIP

Happy coincidence this should bubble up, as I just banged out a decent update. Still far from accomplishing even 5% of what Tony's program does, but I did a single link diagramming tool that graphs trail vs travel.

https://sebwiers.github.io/motorcycl...ngle-link.html



I did buy Tony's program, quite long ago.

Its what I used to decide some design points for the SECApocalypse. I'm sure I've mentioned it several times, with pictures of his program in my build thread. His update for spring forces is excellent.

So why am I doing mine? I want to build a similar program myself for many of the same reason(s) I wanted to build a front end myself. If I had the skill to straight up copy all of what Tony implemented, I wouldn't bother, because I wouldn't be learning from the process. I'm working out what I can do in steps, and hoping to make improvements (slider setups like Saxon / telelever, floating calipers, etc). I'd also like to make it more user friendly, if possible. And much cheaper (as in free / open source) and better distributed (web page / app store), in order to turn more curious fence sitters into builders.
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Old Streetfighter Motorcycle Forum Post 05-10-2018, 12:39 AM   #7
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Default Re: Front end design programe WIP

Wow, and I didn't post first page I finished here? It compares geometry before and after various cahnges (wheel size changes, fork swaps, neck chops, rear end changes, etc).

https://sebwiers.github.io/motorcycl...anner_002.html

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Old Streetfighter Motorcycle Forum Post 05-10-2018, 02:18 AM   #8
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Default Re: Front end design programe WIP

Quote:
Originally Posted by sebwiers View Post
I did buy Tony's program, quite long ago.

Its what I used to decide some design points for the SECApocalypse. I'm sure I've mentioned it several times, with pictures of his program in my build thread. His update for spring forces is excellent.

So why am I doing mine? I want to build a similar program myself for many of the same reason(s) I wanted to build a front end myself. If I had the skill to straight up copy all of what Tony implemented, I wouldn't bother, because I wouldn't be learning from the process. I'm working out what I can do in steps, and hoping to make improvements (slider setups like Saxon / telelever, floating calipers, etc). I'd also like to make it more user friendly, if possible. And much cheaper (as in free / open source) and better distributed (web page / app store), in order to turn more curious fence sitters into builders.
Very commendable reasons! Carry on...
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