EBR!......The Thunder Returns!....

Sadly EBR didnt make it and now has stop operations and closed the doors filing chapter 128. Its very sad but the new EBR's are BASSASS bikes. I have ridden the RX and the SX and if I can still would love to buy one.
After reading through this is post and many others its apparent that other then the higher price tag (RX retail 18,995 and SX retail 16,995 - both have been on sale for $14,995 for a while now), i feel they were not selling due to people not knowing anything about them or the Buell 1125 for that matter. Everyone still thinks they are running Harley engines, etc.

The engines were not Rotax in design. The Buell 1125 engine was designed by Erik Buell / Harley and contracted to Rotax to be built. It was not a rotax designed engine. After Harley closed Buell and gave Erik a non-compete when he left, they dropped that and allowed Buell to have/use his patents. This allowed Erik to use all the best parts of the XB and 1125 bikes, the 1125 engine being one of them. The 1125 design was punched out to an 1190 making an impressive 185 HP and built all in house at EBR. Many rank on the bike instead of demo riding one. Alot of people would be highly surprised how sweet these bikes are after taking one for a spin. They were priced a little higher then a jap liter bike, but i would rather have the EBR SX over anything else.

I hate to see any motorcycle company fold, especially one that likes to do things differently. I also feel that EBR has a special place in American hearts so my opinion probably doesn’t mean so much, kind of like I’m gate-crashing a funeral, but from a European perspective it was never a viable bike over here.

The cost was about £14,000 which puts it in contention with some very nice / cool / interesting bikes from European marques with a good reputation, longevity and a dealership network, like S1000RR, RC8R (both actually cheaper) and close enough to make a 1199 very tempting. Without even looking at the "boring" options from Japan.

As well as that..... it's just a bit fugly. It just is.



Except that subframe. But mis-matched wheels and a fairing that looks like it's from Suzuki in the early 2000's isn't good enough. Maybe again that's to a European eye (i have a friend who is a product designer who does kitchen stuff for the US market and he tells me there is no way euro stuff would sell over there and vice versa, our eyes and brains are just used to a different "look"). But it looks like a 10 year old design, which when you know there's plenty of innovation in that bike seems a shame. The electronics were usually reviewed as good but a generation behind.

And then, there's just the history. If you are buying a new bike, it's partly for prestige and for having something new, but also so that you shouldn't have to worry about service and parts. I don't think many people honestly believed EBR would be around in say, 10 years time. 20? Forget it. And they haven't shaken off the stink of HD either. Not a byword for years of fault free ownership. Even Ducati haven't got too much of a problem with that anymore. I think even if they had sold them here for the same price as in the us ($15k = £10k) there would have been a few more sales but still not an avalanche. The US market is huge of course, I think I’m right in saying that the US is actually Ducati’s biggest market. So a high-spec high-price vee-twin sports bike can do well in the US. Shame that didn’t keep them afloat.

They just seemed a little behind the curve, and didn’t have a great rep, maybe if they had a little more time they could have got up to speed. As a said, still a shame.

Cookie2000ad said:

Except that subframe. But mis-matched wheels and a fairing that looks like it's from Suzuki in the early 2000's isn't good enough. Maybe again that's to a European eye (i have a friend who is a product designer who does kitchen stuff for the US market and he tells me there is no way euro stuff would sell over there and vice versa, our eyes and brains are just used to a different "look"). But it looks like a 10 year old design, which when you know there's plenty of innovation in that bike seems a shame. The electronics were usually reviewed as good but a generation behind.

Click to expand...

I honestly think it was partially due to the fact (I don't know what Erik was thinking personally) that Buell motorcycles were far ahead of their time to begin with when he was working with Harley. Even the Blast was quite a departure from the normality we grew to know as a middleweight bike from the Japanese effort of the 70's and 80's. The XB series was something nobody had seen before as well, and the only real love I have ever seen for Buell was HD guys saying if they ever did own a, "crotch rocket", it would be a Buell, "because it has a Harley engine". :speechless:

I grew up 200 miles from Milwaukee (live even closer now), and know ALOT of Harley enthusiasts (kinda hard not to living in Wisconsin) and it was pretty universal thought process to see Buell as a brand like Ducati, only the few would own them. That stigma never wore off and when Erik opened EBR after his split from HD, the writing was on the wall from the start. I really wish I could dig up the conversations I was having with MarksA-C (right before EBR opened up) discussing the finer points of why EBR was destined for glory or failure with no gray area at all. Basically a very sink or swim situation.

If I was Erik, I would have packed up my marbles, flipped the bird, and gone home before I was pulverized by a difficult market and a stigma around my name. Far be it from me to get into the politics and financial woes of the company and the guy behind the name, but from what I've seen he was pushing a boulder up a very slippery, steep slope. It couldn't go on forever.

Anybody that writes off Erik Buell is on crack. That guy has done more than most, seen all the ups and downs, and still come back year after year. He's been doing this for decades

purpony said:

The engines were not Rotax in design. The Buell 1125 engine was designed by Erik Buell / Harley and contracted to Rotax to be built. It was not a rotax designed engine. After Harley closed Buell and gave Erik a non-compete when he left, they dropped that and allowed Buell to have/use his patents. This allowed Erik to use all the best parts of the XB and 1125 bikes, the 1125 engine being one of them. The 1125 design was punched out to an 1190 making an impressive 185 HP and built all in house at EBR

Click to expand...

Exactly right! They were designing the 1190 when i was there

Buel ? wats that ?



































































:doh: sorry mates just had to

I had figured Polaris was a strong candidate to buy up EBR, since sportbikes are pretty much the only powersport product they don't make. They certainly have the deep pockets needed to get it off the ground.

Ok EBR and whoever is funding it, listen up, here's what you need to do:
-120hp+ to the wheel
-Minimal design. Think FZ09. Not B-king. Show a picture of it to a few people and ask if they would buy something that looked like that. For a new brand, go more conservative than outrageous.
-Liquid cooled v-twin. Probably 1000-1200cc or so. Designed for street use. So it shouldn't shake like a 900lb dildo while at idle. A little vibration gives character, a lot is just annoying and makes the mirrors useless.
-Put the gas in a tank, not in the frame.
-Put the oil in the engine, not in the swingarm.
-HYDRAULIC LIFTERS. Everyone hates valve adjustments. Literally everyone. So what if it adds 2 pounds of weight. Nobody except spec sheet reading keyboard racers care.
-ANALOG TACH
-Simple and easy to perform routine maintenance. Don't bury the oil filter behind fairings or put it above the header so it makes a mess when you remove it. Front of engine, at the bottom, please. Funny how so few bikes manage to get this right.
-Upright riding postition. Supersports might get the moto journalist panties all in a wad, people with checkbooks want a bike they can ride for more than 30 minutes at a time.
-At least mid-shelf suspension. Street riders don't need track grade Ohlins forks that cost 5 grand. Decent Showa or KYB with at least preload and damping adjustment. Maybe offer a "s" model with better stuff.
- MSRP of $12k or less.

Tick those boxes and watch the sales roll in.